23 - The Comfort Crisis and Crucial Conversations

Are modern day comforts negatively impacting you?

Transcript

Tyler Zeeman: 0:00

Welcome everybody to another episode of the Isler Perspective. We are excited to be joining you all today and hope you enjoy the conversation. Let's go.

Kyler Gilstrap: 0:24

I had a lot of fun this morning playing disc golf. Yeah, it was a good time. It's been a hot minute since we've been able to get back out onto a disc golf course. And it was nice just going up into the Canyon and just being able to fling some discs and absolutely nail some trees and lose a couple discs. But it was a lot of fun.

Tyler Zeeman: 0:41

Yeah, it, it really, I mean, I only lost one. Did you lose any? I didn't lose any. No, I'm, I'm too greedy. Yeah. Well mine was like a throwaway disc that I found on another course anyway, so I didn't matter. But in the end I did beat you.

Kyler Gilstrap: 0:53

The best part was when you absolutely knew you were going to lose that disc. You're like, this is the hole I'm going to lose this disc on. And then you flinged it with so much force and enthusiasm. But as soon as it left your hand, you're like, yep, that one's gone. Well, you know, you

Tyler Zeeman: 1:06

just got to go for it sometimes. And sometimes it'll work. Yeah, just send it. And I mean, in the end, Again, I still won. Yeah. Yeah. That was a rough

Kyler Gilstrap: 1:16

down to the last putt. I should've had it. It was like a five foot putt, even though it was straight through a tree. I should've

Tyler Zeeman: 1:21

had it. Yeah. Sorry, everybody. I'm typing really quick, a quick prompt that just reminded me of why I think Kyler and I like golf, disc golfing so much. So, Oh, okay. So

Kyler Gilstrap: 1:32

while he's, while he's typing up this prompt, let me tell you this story. So I got into disc golf I would say two or three years ago. Mostly because I was looking at the price of regular golf clubs and how dang expensive it was going to be for them. And then the cost it would take to go to golf courses. And I just kept on sitting there. Just, I couldn't justify it. And I know that I had played like ultimate frisbee before and that I'd thrown javelin back in high school. And I just remember, I think I played disc golf once before for like a young men's activity or like a mutual activity. And I had a lot of fun with that, but I was just like, you know what? Let me just look into it and see if I can get into it. And as my normal ADHD brain goes, or goes about a hundred miles an hour and I switch hobbies about every 28 to 30 days, I got into the hobby of disc golf and I just bought a couple of discs to start. And it's a gateway drug for anyone who knows about disc golf. And next thing I know, I have a whole disc golf. Backpack caddy bag and it's full of all sorts of different discs and flight paths and everything else. And it's a lot of fun. And then I go to my buddy Tyler and I go, Hey man, you should come play disc golf with me. And Tyler was like, well, that's dumb. Like who's going to play disc golf. That's just a silly sport. And I, I, I was just like, dude, you just got to try it. So just come with me. And then he came with me one time and now he's just as addicted as I am. Yeah,

Tyler Zeeman: 2:56

it's a good time. And so here is the stats that I was trying to find. So I've been reading a book when I say read, I mean, listen, because my ADHD does not allow me to read a book. So I've been listening to a book. called the comfort crisis. Okay. And in the comfort crisis it talks a lot about a lot of different things. But one of them is kind of the value of being in nature and being outdoors and how in today's modern age where we've created so much technology and basically we're living from being inside our house to going to our car, to going into a building, sitting in another chair, right? We don't really spend time outside where we're living in a perfectly climate controlled environment. Almost our entire lives, especially in the US. Oh,

Kyler Gilstrap: 3:37

yeah, that's interesting to think about.

Tyler Zeeman: 3:38

Right. We aren't in nature We're living and everything is perfectly controlled and we're comfortable We want our house to be you know 72 degrees or whatever it is and we go to our car do the same thing and then we go into another place and do The same thing but we're typical within walls and we're looking at screens. That's what we do. Yeah Well in the comfort crisis, it talks about a couple of things. I'm gonna read Some of these statistics that it mentions, but spending time in nature has been shown to reduce symptoms of anxiety, depression, and stress. A study in this book found that people who spent at least 120 minutes per week in nature reported significantly higher, higher levels of health and wellbeing. Nature exposure can enhance cognitive functions. Research in that book mentioned that time spent in nature can And it's in that setting can improve your attention memory and creativity and another study along with it. One study found that if you walk in nature, just going out for like a walk, maybe 20 minutes, three times a week will lead to a 20 percent improvement in your short term memory.

Kyler Gilstrap: 4:42

Interesting.

Tyler Zeeman: 4:42

It also does other things such as lower blood pressure. Improves cardiovascular health, builds a stronger immune system. And in fact, in Japan, they created a program where If somebody was sick, had diabetes or cardiovascular disease or cancer, they would go and do forest baths where they would take people out to the wilderness and they would just sit and just listen. But when you're out in this nature, in these nature settings, you can't have your phone on. You can't be listening to music, can't be doing these things. You just got to kind of take in what your surrounding is listening to. To the silence of, so when you

Kyler Gilstrap: 5:17

say forest bath, you're not talking about like an actual, no, you're talking

Tyler Zeeman: 5:20

about like a sound bath where it's like you're enveloped into, into nature, the moment. Yeah, exactly. So they would send them out there and they were seeing it healthy improvement and results. And so anyways, I think that's why you and I love disc golf because it allows us to go get in the nature. We're able to turn our phones off. Especially when you go up hobble creek where there's no service That's the best and we're able to just be involved in nature and just have a good time and it's just beautiful

Kyler Gilstrap: 5:44

Yeah, you got a good point there. I do love nature. It's it's something that i've always loved I feel like I just have a natural connection to it and it's more It's more spiritual to me going up into nature than it is going to a building.

Tyler Zeeman: 5:58

Yeah, 100 percent like yeah, I I think There's several aspects to that You And the more I reflect on life and try and like feel, feel in tune with like my soul, I recognize that my soul is from nature, right? If that makes any sense, like as I, so the other day I was just kind of meditating ish and I can really feel every inhale and exhale just being like an inhale of something new and an exhale of baggage. Yeah. And every exhale was just so Relieving and every inhale just brought new life into me And I feel like when you go into the forest and you go into the woods that happens naturally You don't have to really think about it. It just happens.

Kyler Gilstrap: 6:54

Well, I just love like the energy like the connectivity of everything it's like you get into the forest and you just feel like you're Actually connected to the earth like the way it should be. Yeah, like I feel like for some reason I mean, how often do you get do people go their whole lives without ever touching grass? You Like there's there's people that live in new york That I've only ever been on pavement. And for me, it's like just getting the dirt between my toes or like my feet planted on the earth, just to feel nature and feel the energy and vibrations. It's just so refreshing and relieving. And it almost takes me to a place of just peace. So I could totally understand how. being in nature for just two hours a week. That's not that much time would, would reduce anxiety and depression and all those other things.

Tyler Zeeman: 7:41

Yeah. Well, something crazy you mentioned also in the comfort crisis kind of aligns with that. You guys, if you are looking for a book, check out the comfort crisis. Thank you, Kellen, for the suggestion. But in the comfort crisis, it mentions just like what you said, there's actually a growing population of the world who Never leaves their home and they don't need to they're able to stay in their house because they have what they need they can order Food to be delivered and they can get remote work and in Japan It's actually considered a significant social issue Which is funny because it's coming from the same country that created the initiative to get people into the forest and do the forest bath

Kyler Gilstrap: 8:17

Well, that what it's it's just because they have such a far sides, like they don't have a good balance dichotomy and so they're going to have the real extreme to one side and the real extreme to the other side to try to find that balance.

Tyler Zeeman: 8:29

Right. And they actually have a name for this population of individuals called Hika Mori. And I don't remember the exact percentage. It was like 20 percent or I don't remember. We're going to ignore those numbers, but essentially these individuals withdraw from social life. They just stay in their homes for months, even years. And. It's typically younger people. They just isolate themselves from society because of social pressure or academics or work stress or mental health, just personal preference. So there, there's a huge population of people that just aren't leaving their homes again because it's comfortable. They don't have to hunt for food. They don't have to chase anything down to get food. They don't even have to go to the store to get their food. It's literally all brought to them. That was one

Kyler Gilstrap: 9:11

of the things I really liked when I visited Norway was just the, the, It was a weird, it was a weird culture just because we aren't used to it as Americans, but when you are out and about like traveling and work or stuff like that, you don't just. Have a small talk with people. You just stick to yourself. Like there's nothing you, you just, you don't like if you sat across the train, you wouldn't just strike up a conversation with someone. Like they just absolutely ignore you. And it's not to be rude. It's just because it's like. They believe that you're on your own path and there's no reason that they should derail you. Maybe you're doing your own thing. But the difference is when they're in nature, they're the most kindest, warm hearted people because they feel like nature is where if you're out in nature, you're out there too. experience it and experience with other people. So they're more willing to chat with you and just like strike up random conversations. So like on hikes or out on different tour guide y type things, they love talking with you. But if you are like on the bullet train or on a bus going to work or something, it was just like, no, we're not going to talk to you. You're just doing your own thing and I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna get in the way.

Tyler Zeeman: 10:20

Interesting.

Kyler Gilstrap: 10:21

Yeah.

Tyler Zeeman: 10:21

I would, I would love to go out there. There's so much of the world that I want to see. And again, like I don't want to see. The main things right? I don't want to go to Paris and see the Eiffel Tower. I have zero desire I want to go to France and I want to see the country. I want to go see nature I want to see nature all around the world I want to see what's different around the world from what nature created not from what man created I can see those pictures right and seeing a picture of the Eiffel Tower I feel like is the same as going to the Eiffel Tower, but when you go in nature It's different than looking at pictures because then you get in nature and you're hearing nature sounds you're hearing the breath of nature You're feeling that energy that's coming from it.

Kyler Gilstrap: 11:02

Yeah, it's true. It's really cool. I like that a lot. Yeah, I really love this hat You got me

Tyler Zeeman: 11:07

Yeah, I it's super cool. So shout out to Honey hats co I believe is what you're called. Oh, no. Did I just botch it? I'm gonna hurry and check and I Probably did. I'm sorry, Kaylee.

Kyler Gilstrap: 11:19

Yeah. Tyler did this awesome gift for us where he got us personalized the Isler perspective hats with our logo and everything. It looks freaking awesome.

Tyler Zeeman: 11:28

Yeah. Crushed it. Yeah. So honey hat co H U N N Y H a T. Go to them, follow them on Instagram. If you would like a Isler perspective hat, Send us an email and we'll, we'll make it happen. They're really cool. And if you wanted any other kind of hat or customization, they're great right now. They have American flag hats and then you also have a really cool smiley face. It's a Utah smiley face. It's a U T for the eyes. And then a smiley face, really adorable. So reach out happy to go ahead and get you connected with them. Or again, you can go to their Instagram honey hat. So thank you, Tyler.

Kyler Gilstrap: 12:06

And thank you, Kaylee. For the sweet hat. The best part is that Tyler was trying to surprise me with it. And I had seen some pictures that I think Kaylee had posted on her Instagram and had tagged us in a story. And I didn't realize that the story was something that she had actually created. I thought I was just another one of those businesses that was reaching out, trying to show you what they could do for you. And to be honest, I, I'm really bad and I ignore most of those. So it was a really cool surprise when you actually gifted it to me this morning and I love it. I'm gonna wear it all everywhere. Yeah, it mean it looks

Tyler Zeeman: 12:39

really good. It's comfortable. So, great work, Kaylee. And shout out to Maddie. I dunno if you helped on these ones too. Maddie. Yeah, it was Maddie, which is funny'cause that's your wife. I got confused. I get messed up. I was like, wait, my wife helped with this too. How dare she No. All right guys, so Kyler has a cool story that he's gonna share. And then we're gonna talk about another book again. Any of you who are. Looking to improve your life. I think the comfort crisis would be a great book to read. But now we're going to segue into the next aspect of this conversation. And I think Kyler's story will be a good segue to the next book and talking point that we have. So Kyler, go ahead and share that story.

Kyler Gilstrap: 13:19

Cool. So a couple weeks ago, I had the opportunity to take someone to jail. I, I know, right? It's such a sweet opportunity. But what had happened was I was just, you know, patrolling an area and I recognized a vehicle that was parked and knew the, knew the person, knew that they had a warrant out for their arrest. And unfortunately they are living in their vehicle, having some hard times. And so I had made contact with them. Unfortunately I woke them up, which is a bad way to wake up. And within the first couple of minutes, they were already in handcuffs. And you know, going from, Being absolutely out sleeping to a couple minutes later in half handcuffs can be Kind of jolting it's gonna be kind of a surprise and knowing that you're going to jail is Is not fun, especially when all you have is what's inside your vehicle and this person They were a little distraught and didn't want to go to jail because they were worried about their vehicle being impounded and their dog going to the shelter and all these other things. And so, something that seemed so easy that they could have taken care of on their own. Has now turned into this giant mountain and that person, you know, they wanted to resist and wanted to try to not go to jail. And sometimes in law enforcement, you have to be able to know how to we, we call it volume control. It's how to turn up and down the volume of the situation so that you can gain control of the situation and then you bring it back down. And it was interesting for this experience because. You know, he was trying to pull away from me trying to fight me a little bit and resist just generally resist arrest And I had to secure him up against his vehicle and when I did so I was I was pretty intense You know, I I haven't gotten in a in a

Tyler Zeeman: 15:12

altercation.

Kyler Gilstrap: 15:13

Yeah an altercation a fight whatever you want to call it I haven't been in a physical altercation For a very long time in law enforcement because most of the time I can talk with people and just from perspectives or with de escalation I'm able to, you know, help solve the issue. But sometimes, you know, you just have to rise to the level of the situation. So then you can bring the situation back down. This is one of those moments where I had him up against his vehicle and you know, he, he had started yelling at me. So I started yelling at him and I was very loud and I was just like, you really don't want to fight me today. I really don't want to hurt you and this is going to hurt if we get to this to this level And we were kind of yelling back and forth each other for a second And the next thing I knew I was whispering in his ear Not like seductively or anything like that, but I was just like Listen, man. I want to work with you, but I need you to work with me The bottom line is is you're going to jail today But if you're willing to work with me I'll help you out so that your car doesn't get impounded and your dog doesn't go to the shelter and all these other things And he just that quick change of like a loud aggression yelling to now you're whispering and talking like a normal person and you take that second to breathe and widen your, your tunnel vision. It changes the, the mood and the, and the movement for the person. Like most people, when they get into arguments or conversations and stuff, you're like, Oh, They keep building, building, building until you're both yelling at each other. Cause you both want to be heard. Sometimes what it takes is going back down to just a whisper and it, and it throws them off so much. It threw him off so much that he was just like, you do that for me. And I was like, listen, dude, I know this isn't a huge warrant. You're not going to go away forever, but you got to get it taken care of. Cause the judge wants to see you. So how about we go get this taken care of? You'll probably be in jail for a couple hours. They'll release you. What I'll do for you is I'll take your dog so that he doesn't have to sit in a hot car because it's hot right now. I'll take them over to the shelter. I'll just put an older, an owner hold on them so that they can hold your dog until you get out. When you get out, I'm going to give you my business card. You can call me and I'll help you get your dog back. And I'll even give you a ride back to your truck. Like I'm not here to make your life harder, but I have a job to do. And unfortunately right now you also have to, you have to face the music, you know? After that, he kind of calmed down a little bit, got him back, got him back to another partner's car, put him in that car. And as we're talking, he's like, I've got morning medication I need to take. It's okay if I take it. I'm like, yeah, that's fine. You know, as long as it's prescribed to you and I got his medication for him. And then as I'm doing that, he goes, did you find all the marijuana in the car? And I was like, no, I was just looking for your medication. And he's like, well, there's a bunch of marijuana in the car too. Here's where it's at. And so I go back to get the marijuana and I'm like, God, this guy's being like really reasonable now. And I go back to him with all his marijuana. And I was like, this is all in prescription bottles. Do you have a, do you have a medical marijuana card? He goes, yeah, it's in my wallet. I was like, all right, can I, can I see it? He goes, yeah, I pull it out. It's valid. Everything's good. So I was like, well, you can have this. There's no reason for you not to have this. So I'll go secure it back in your vehicle. He's like, Oh, he was shocked. He's like, I never thought I was going to be getting out of jail and still have my marijuana. I'm like, dude, you're doing it all legally. There's nothing, there's nothing illegal about this, so I can't, I can't hurt you for that. Yeah. And then it was funny cause while he was in the back of the truck, he finally came to realization. He's like, you know, I didn't, I didn't, he's like, I acted irrational. He's like, I'm sorry for yelling. I'm sorry for fighting. And it was, it was interesting because he had, he'd even like when, when I first told him he was going to jail, his initial response was, I, I perceived that he was trying to defecate himself. Like he was bearing down, but only sound came out, no substance. Because he thought that maybe that would keep him from going to jail. I don't know. That's just my perception. Either way, he calmed down enough to the point where he goes, You know, I apologize for that. I'm sorry. You're being really nice to me and I'm sorry for the way I acted. And I said, I understand the way you reacted because you went from dead sleep to now you're going to jail and your whole life could crumble if I wanted it to. I was like, I don't want it to, I want you to take care of your stuff. And so I took him to jail. He was really nice and cordial from that point on. I left him with my business card. I said, as soon as you go, give me a call, help you get your dog back. I'll give you a ride home. A couple hours goes by. He gets out, I'm in my office typing up some reports and I see that he came to the shelter. He's got dog back. He was able to get his dog back, no problems, but he had a ride. So I didn't have to, I didn't, I didn't even go and talk to him. But then a few hours later, before I checked off shift that night, he called me on my cell phone and I answered and I go, Hey, you know, what's going on. And he goes, I just wanted to call you to thank you again for how Well, you responded to the situation. He was like, I'm really grateful that you did this for me. He's like, thank you for not taking my car. Thank you for taking care of my dog, because my dog's everything to me. And he's like, and thank you for taking me to jail. He's like, cause I needed that. And he's like, I just wanted to call you to tell you, thank you. Because you know, most officers would have treated me differently and would have been a lot more mean to me. And I just appreciated that you treated me like a human and you've, and I felt like I was seen. And I was like, wow, you know, that's, that's cool. I didn't expect for this phone call, but thanks for calling me and thanking me. And I said, oh, and by the way, you know, your driver's license isn't valid right now either. I was like, so I don't want you to get in further trouble. Like everyone knows where you're parked now. And if they see you driving around there, no, your driver's license is not valid. So just be cautious. And he's like, oh, I'll get that taken care of too. And I was like, okay, I just wanted you to be aware. Don't don't need to get in more trouble than you need to. It's funny. A couple of days after that, he pulled, he drives into the gas station. Now I'm getting a drink out with some of my friends and he sees me and he goes, Oh, Hey officer. Yeah, it's so great. And acted like we were long lost. Friends came up and shook my hand and was just like, man, it's so great to see you. Yeah. Yeah. No, life's good. All this stuff, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, yeah, you just got to stay cool in all this hot weather and living out of your car. It's not easy. And he's like, yeah, it's not easy, but you know, we're, we're getting taken care of and I'm just like, man, it was, it was really, it just different. It just goes to show you that like just being able to see people as people and being able to communicate with them. And you know, everyone's got a job to do. Law enforcement officers aren't always out there to make your life hell, but sometimes their job requires them to make some tough decisions. And as long as you act like a normal person, you'll be treated like a normal person. That's that's my hope anyway for most contact with law enforcement

Tyler Zeeman: 22:07

Yeah, it all really comes down to how you start treating the situation in the beginning. I feel like when you look at a Typical video where something went wrong on a on a stop It's typically because the person who was pulled over Is going in hostile right away or defensive right away, but I found so Obviously I have i'm a little Biased perspective, right? I'm a white male who grew up with a Police officer father and I was around them all the time. So it doesn't stress me out at all to get pulled over Because when they pull up I just have a good conversation with them Apologize for whatever it was I did and

Kyler Gilstrap: 22:45

most of the times, you know

Tyler Zeeman: 22:46

what you did, too Yeah, usually it's like yeah, you're right. Like I was I was speeding I was six over ten over. I'm my apologies I've had one ticket Kyler. I've been pulled over 20 times. I believe that but it how many of those times

Kyler Gilstrap: 22:59

Did you get your butt handed to you by your dad later on? None. Really? I would've thought that people would've been like, Oh, I know your dad. I'm going to give him a call and just solve the problem that way.

Tyler Zeeman: 23:08

No. Yeah. Well, so there's definitely been times where people recognize me from doing training scenarios, right? So that those ones don't count because they knew me or

Kyler Gilstrap: 23:17

tell that story about doing training scenarios. Okay. I just

Tyler Zeeman: 23:19

want

Kyler Gilstrap: 23:19

to make sure people knew that what that reference was. Yeah.

Tyler Zeeman: 23:22

And then there's other times where they like recognize my last name asked if my dad was, was who he was. I said, yeah. And then, so that would help. But a good majority of them were just simply me. Being ready. They came over I apologized, gave everything. There's only one time where it was scary because my wallet dropped down under the seat. So I was grabbing that and the cop came up with his hand on his gun cause he thought I was grabbing a gun and I was like, Oh, I'm sorry. Right. So it all depends on how you're doing it. Like. It looked like I was grabbing for a gun so he was ready to go. And if I would have come up fast, or if I would have reacted stupid, something stupid would have happened. So it's just how you behave. But I think where I want to go with this, Kyler, is you did a really good job in the situation you just discussed of de escalating the situation and creating a safe space. Even though the other guy was in handcuffs and you were taking him to jail, you created a safe space for him. And It's key to conversations. There's another book that I'm going to recommend for everybody to read. It's called crucial conversations by Stephen Covey. You can also find it out at the company crucial learning. They have several other great books as well. The great thing about this is crucial conversations. It will help you in your personal relationships, it will help you in your work relationships, and help you have an overall better outlook on life. I did a post the other day on this, Kyler, and I'm just going to read it really quick so we can kind of go through it. This isn't really everything the book talks about but anyways, I wrote, Is it possible to understand someone with a completely different perspective? I believe it is, but it requires setting aside your own desire to be understood. Instead, focus on understanding where they are coming from and what shaped their views, without letting your own opinions cloud the process. This doesn't mean that you have to agree with them, but just try to understand them. We all come from diverse backgrounds and experiences that form our core beliefs and these beliefs influence how we respond to the world and often lead us to take sides on polarizing topics. If you all have watched Inside Out 2, where it talks about core beliefs, you'll kind of understand this image, right? But understanding and genuinely caring for the person on the other side of the conversation is the first step of bridging any type of knowledge gap between the two of you or understanding gap. So, when it comes down to it, I mean, the first thing that comes to my mind right now is relationships, right? With your spouse. Are you going into the conversations in a safe space? Are you going into it with a similar outcome that you're both aiming for? Are you trying to understand where your partner's coming from in the conversation and not trying to force your understanding or your point of view on them? There is a time and a place for that, but it doesn't all have to happen in the same conversation and understanding them is valuable. The next area that comes to my mind is politics where, I mean, I am not happy with our candidates right now. But trying to understand each side, right? Why do people like this person? Why do you like that person? Right. Did you watch the debate? Yeah, but I watched a different version of the debate. I didn't watch the regular debate. I watched the real debate is what it was called where Kennedy actually had the live debate going and then they would pause it and then he would also respond and join the conversation. Yeah. Everybody knows who's friends with me. I am, I'm, I'm going to vote for RFK. And if it ends up being that it was a quote unquote, wasted vote, so be it, but I'm not going to vote out of fear. I'm going to vote out of hope. And I don't see the country having hope with either their Trump or Biden.

Kyler Gilstrap: 27:13

I was, I was very surprised by the

Tyler Zeeman: 27:18

presidential debate. It was a pissing match about who can golf better.

Kyler Gilstrap: 27:22

Well, I was just, I was just disappointed because I feel like. a little bit of concern as it seemed like there was, I mean, both these guys have been presidents of the United States already, so that's great. Both these guys have been living long enough that maybe there should be somebody else that's, that's representing the parties. I have, I have my own personal opinions about bipartisanship anyway, and I struggle with that. But I was just the thing that really kind of grinds my gears the most about the debates was just the fact that They weren't answering the questions never there's so many questions that were pure questions that Americans want to know the answers to because it makes a difference for us And instead it was deflection deflection mud throwing like you talked about speaking about golf handicaps and i'm sitting there thinking like These people are supposed to run our country. I understand that you guys have a TIF with each other, and so it's going to be very difficult for you to go into a, some sort of debate scenario where you actually come out the better. But for me, I mean, in any sort of political platform, when I watch the debates, I watch for people who are genuine, who have pure intent, and you can see it easily in a debate.

Tyler Zeeman: 28:48

Yeah.

Kyler Gilstrap: 28:49

For example, a couple of years ago, there was a debate. In our county and one candidate answered the questions, you know, with, with as much education and with good candor. Another candidate was trying to throw mud and that person got shut down quick. And the last candidate, I don't know what they were doing, but it just, it was clear to me. That the first candidate was the one that was going to get elected. Right. And it happened, but that was the hard part is like watching the presidential debate. All I could see is like, I don't want to vote for either of these guys. Exactly. And it's, and it's difficult because you would think that there would be, and you know that there's better leaders out there who could be qualified to run this country. And it's just sad to see. This is what it's come to and I know I've listened to some of my friends who live in different countries who've made a mockery of the United States lately. Yeah. Why wouldn't you? And it's sad because you do feel like we're on this precipice of something happening inside the country, but you hope not, but you don't really know because. There's so much polarization. It's like everyone's so charged and ready for something to pop off that you feel it, but yet you haven't yet seen it. And it's kind of a terrifying time to live in.

Tyler Zeeman: 30:02

Yeah, a hundred percent. And that's, again, that's why I think this book, Crucial Conversations is so important because again, it's polarizing people. So there was a statistic. We may have talked about this in an earlier episode. But young people are leaving Religion faster than they ever have before But people like community and they long for community. So where are these younger people finding that? and political party And so then the conversation that used to be a religious debate has now become a political debate Not only that though But the younger generation doesn't do this in person. They don't know how to have good conversations They do it over social media and it's loud and it gets viral and it goes and it expands and it creates polarization Polarization even worse

Kyler Gilstrap: 30:48

Yeah, you're right. And I think the hardest part is that most people aren't trying to have a conversation to find common ground. They're trying to have a conversation that's one sided that just gets their perspective put out there and they don't want to have to field any of the arguments against it. And for, for example, I, I really love the quote you shared at the beginning that you posted on your Instagram. I feel like that's very important because I have a lot of friends who have different perspectives. And I enjoy that they have different perspectives. And one things that isn't talked about is religion and politics because they are so polarizing. But what was something that was a lesson for me to learn was I met somebody who had a very interesting perspective on something that I was, I was reticent to be willing to accept him into my friend group. And, you know, sometimes. You have to protect yourself and your friends from others, and I felt a little bad about it, to be honest, because I, I didn't want to be like a negative person, but at the same time, I needed to just understand better, and so I had to put my feelings aside and take time to hear him, and the more I studied, and the more I listened to what he had to say, The more I was able to see that his perspective wasn't as polarizing as I put it out to be initially or as others may have made it sound. And so it helped me to realize that, you know, I had a preconceived notion of this person that was charged by, you know, past feelings or experiences that I have issues with and that wasn't giving him grace. And it took some time for me to, to just hear his perspective and take my emotions out of it and just be more willing to understand. And when I was able to do that, I was able to see, ah, he's actually a pretty good dude and I'm, and I'm okay with hanging out with them because he does bring value even though it is almost, It's the complete opposite of how I feel or how I perceive things, but everyone has value. And like we've shared before, the more you get to understand people, especially the ones with the complete opposite perspective from you, the better you understand, you know, whatever God you want to believe in.

Tyler Zeeman: 33:16

Yeah. Yeah. I, again, I mean, I think we're, we're heading on over and over again, but go into the conversations without feeling like you have to prove your point. That's going to deescalate the other person if they're coming in hot. And then once you've shown them the respect to listen to them, typically they're going to show you the respect and listen to you. And then you guys can find that common ground. And if there is none, that's totally fine. But this again, really comes in strong in relationships, whether it's a friend or a significant other, you've got to create a safe space and Don't try to just force your, your point of view on the other person. Listen and try and see their side. The

Kyler Gilstrap: 33:59

beauty

Tyler Zeeman: 33:59

in life

Kyler Gilstrap: 34:00

is knowing that we all don't have to be the exact same person. And I think it's so hard for people to. Wrap their mind around the idea, especially here in the Valley. Oh yeah. That, that you, you, it's okay to be different. It's okay to think differently. It's okay to have different perspectives. And you know what? There's a lot of people who will want to argue about all the different changes in the world that we've talked about before. From, you know, like people who are the LGBTQ plus all the, all the different rights and things like that. And people might have really skewed perspectives, but the thing is, is like, there's still people. They have a right to their perspective. They have a right to what they think. You know, whatever it may be, it might be completely out of the realm of possibility for your mind to wrap around. But for them, it's life. And who are we to say that their perspective isn't valued or important? And I just, I just think it's cool to be able to bring about a An area where they can't have those safe conversations. And that's what I'm hoping this podcast is providing is an opportunity to, for people to feel safe and for people to feel heard. Cause I think that's one of the things that we're lacking a lot in our society today is that too many people want to talk and not enough people want to listen. And so when we get those opportunities to hear people out, then it's creating that safe space, like you're saying, and we don't have to end the conversation with, Oh, you're right. I'm going to change to whatever you think. It's not always a debate. Sometimes it's fun just to listen and learn and say, that's a really cool perspective. I like the way you think about that doesn't mean I have to change my way to think the same way that I I'll say that there has been a lot of people who have helped open my perspective to the point that I'm not so narrow minded anymore. And I'm a lot more accepting because I learn more. And when you're willing to learn more. You're, you're gaining more. Yeah. You really can't

Tyler Zeeman: 35:59

lose. If you are out there and you believe that you have a polarizing view or a different perspective than a lot of people, and you want to get your voice out there, reach out to us, let us know. We'd love to have you on the podcast and let you share your perspective. We're not going to tell anybody that they're wrong or they're, they're dumb. We're going to listen. We might have things that we'll chime in for and comment on and create a good conversation and dialogue, but we want to hear your perspective. We want to hear your unique view. And so if you have anything that you think would be great to share, reach out to us. We'd love to have you on the podcast.

Kyler Gilstrap: 36:34

Absolutely. One of my friends from high school, I've noticed on their social media, they have been very brave to come out and, and say that they're trans. And I thought it was so cool. And the more I follow their story and I'm, and I'm just following it on the wayside. They probably don't even listen to our podcast, but the more I follow the story, I've, I've known them for years. And I just think it's so neat to hear their story. I'd love to have her on the podcast. It would be incredible

Tyler Zeeman: 37:04

That would be good because I think we talked about this in one of our previous episodes How do we, that's, I mean, society is, has that involved, it's not a large percentage, right, of people who are LGBTQ IA or trans, it's not a huge percentage, but it's there, and our kids are going to see it, and so how do we Teach our kids to treat people nicely, right? We teach them color doesn't matter How do we teach them that sexual preference doesn't matter or the way that they dress right? And so having them on to have that conversation and dialogue, I think would be valuable. Absolutely Maybe i'll reach out to them and see yeah, they're willing to Awesome. Thank you everybody for your time today. Again, send any of those emails to us. We'll have you on the podcast or if you don't want to be on, you just want to simply write up what your perspective is. We can talk about it for you. Absolutely.

Kyler Gilstrap: 37:56

Thanks everybody. Have

Tyler Zeeman: 37:57

a great week.